Impinged ulnar nerve?

[venky]

Sooo..

My mom's had numbness in the ulnar side of her left hand, along with her pinky and ring finger, for about two months. She refuses to see a doctor about it, but complains every few days to me about it. :roll: For the better part of the last year, she's had the mentality that my massage school was for either cultists or primarily hippies, and disregarded any kind of legitimacy in massage treatment, but she's starting to ask me questions about how it works, how it's done, etc. She asked me to palpate her upper body/shoulders/neck the other day because she was in a lot of pain, and wanted to know if tension was the cause. The whole area was GRANITE. Of course, she refused a massage when I offered one on the spot. she's never been touchy-feely in any way, and doesn't feel comfortable. I don't push it. But anyway:

Tonight, I was shopping around on realbodywork.com and came across their preview clip from their Nerve Mobilization DVD, which addressed the ulnar nerve - in short, I heard that numbness in the last two fingers on the hand can be a symptom of ulnar nerve impingment, and my jaw about hit my keyboard. I'm still taking anatomy courses, so I'm not up on all of the elements of specific things that can tweak and cause pain elsewhere - but of course, possible muscle issues make perfect sense to me.

Of course, I Google 'ulnar nerve impingment' and these treatment sites come up that tell you to go to a doctor, who'll give you anti-inflammatory drugs and maybe some prednizone, and hook you up to a machine to test for nerve response, and maybe operate if needed. :shock: Maybe it's a (half) good thing that she hasn't sought a (western) doctor's attention for this...

Aside from scouting out this video to get more info on the possibilities, where else can I find out more info about possible ways to free up this problem? Do the symptoms sound pretty true to a squished ulnar nerve, or should I look out for something more systemic? Not that I'm trying to be my mom's doctor (and not saying that she would accept my help if offered), but I heard this information and figured it'd be worth a shot.

TIA

 

[Life In Technicolor]

me too

i did the same thing... i was stupid and was playing a game on the computer. I had my elbow bent and my head in my hand leaning on my elbow for a few hours playing a game on the computer.. when i realized my fingers (ring and pinky) were numb..
hanging your arm out a car window, leaning on a flexed elbow, sleeping with bent elbow curled up under your chin while sleeping.. all can make the ulnar nerve become inpinged..
I took aleive, saw my chriopractor she used ultra sound on my elbow, told me to use Ice and within a week my tingles and numbness were gone.. Intermittant numbness everytime I flex my elbow or put pressure on it..
tell your mom to not lean on a flexed elbow, keep her arm straight while sleeping and see what happens.
do some arm work medial side, try both sides flexors and extensors..all the way up to shoulder. pa;pate the ulnar grove medial side of the elbow at the crease it will be tender..
good luck

 

[piscesram30]

Hey, Backrub:

I have some personal experience with this I would like to share. 2 years ago I went through almost four months of pain and numbing of my left arm and hand -- the doctors took X-rays, MRIs, the works, and all they could come up with was putting me on painkillers which I did not want and did not tolerate well. I was a freelance writer and couldn't work all those months and was downright miserable. I couldn't even lift a dish out of the dishwasher. After much medical expense, the only thing the doctors came up with was that I might have one or two of three things: "Rotator cuff iinjury, tennis elbow and/or carpal tunnel syndrome." Well, that was a great help -- all the pain was still there and I could not make a living!

Long story short: my husband mentioned my problem to the wife of a friend of his who was a massage therapist and she recommended I see a JFB-MFR Therapist an hour and a half away. It was miraculous! The very first visit 3/4 of my pain disappeared and by the second session it was GONE. It was "Thoracic Outlet Syndrome" -- not any of the above-mentioned doctors' diagnoses.

I was so blown away that I switched careers at age 53 and am now a certified massage therapist with my own home clinic. There is good info on the web about TOS (Thoracic Outlet Syndrome) -- when I went online before my session I was amazed at all the symptoms I had had that the doctors never even asked me about!

BTW, Klowe above made some very good recommendations! Once in awhile, if I sleep on my side with bent elbow under my chin I will feel the numbness again -- which dissipates if I turn over on my back and straighten my arm out. Good advice, Klowe!

Hope this helps your mom, Backrub!

Sherry

 

[Pompal 09.]

BackRub, the nerve mobilization video is very useful for addressing ulnar nerve symptoms. The key to treatment is determining where the compression is taking place, then loosening up the whole line of muscles were the nerve runs, starting at the spine.

Numbness/tingling in the 5th finger, side of the hand and ulnar side of the 4th finger is the symptom of ulnar nerve compression. If she doesn't want you touching her much, you can determine which muscles are likely to be tight by asking her to show you what movement makes the N/T reduce and which one(s) make it increase.

Typical areas of impingement are scalenes, pec minor/major, and the upper arm.

If her N/T is not localized to the side of the hand/4th/5th digits, she may have other nerve compression, TOS or compression of the entire brachial plexus in the upper chest. Sometimes treatment of the above areas leaves the problem unresolved, and you may have to treat the posterior muscles next to the spine between the occiput and mid-scapula, since they can cause problems at the nerve root.

You can treat this condition with your mother fully clothed, using tense and relax stretches, (PIR, MET, AIS, etc) so she would be more comfortable.

Chiropractic care may help with these symptoms too, but will be less than effective if Mom's muscles are like granite.

If you have access to the Nerve Mobilization video I think it would be very useful to you and mom, and worth the $50.

 

[justicefmichael]

Great advice from everyone once again.

Just wanted to add a couple great reference books for your future use for other conditions as well:

Informed Touch
(A Clinician's Guide to the Evaluation and Treatment
of Myofascial Disorders)
By Donna Finando, L.Ac., LMT and
Steven Finando, Ph.D., L.Ac.
This book not only shows drawings with the area of pain highlighted in red, but is supported by a breakdown of the
Pain Patterns, Causative factors, Satellite trigger points,
Affected Organ Symptoms, Associated zones, meridians, & points. In addition each section covers stretching & strengthening exercises. The Appendix lists info on each of the organ meridian pathways followed by a quick reference section of the Pain Patterns broken down by sections of the body, and a Symptom Index.

Active Isolate Stretching:
The Mattes Method
By Aaron L. Mattes
http://www.stretchingusa.com

This work & Aaron's book are an invaluable asset to anyone
who wants to help their clients really open up their bodies &
help them to restore range of motion & overall flexibility, as well as improve athletic performance. It is well organized and covers the entire body very thoroughly. And from personal experience I can say attending his classes was a real highlight in my ongoing training too !

Good luck with getting your Mom to "open up" mine is the same way!

 

[Ryan / Stumpy]

Any time there is a "feeling like granite", I want to go after those restrictions with JFB-MFR.

Even if your mother does not like the idea of traditional massage, she might not mind MFR as much. If you haven't taken any of John's seminars, at least try the following: apply gentle but sustained (minimum two minutes) pressure to the hardened area(s). I have done this to a number of my elderly clients and it is often enough to soften the area.

Worth a try.

 

[Jimmy G]

Everybody!

Thank you SOOO much for the wonderful suggestions and references. :jiggy: Looks like I've got my work cut out for me

I LOVE THIS FORUM! You guys are the Best!!

 

[Matthew K]

This is probably way too old now for people to be reading. But I have to say if you get the chance to watch the dvd, or buy it, it is well worth the money. The gentleman who did the video (Doug Alexander) is fantastic, and is well known for his fanatisicm about nerves. He teaches all over the place.

Okay plug over

 

[mgdagent79]

Back Rub Monster,

Do you have an update for us on your mom's condition? Any success?


I too have the ulner nerve issues and last summer went to a PT for treatment under workmans comp. (office work job) The physical therapy did not help at all!!!

But what I learned in massage school did. One of my teachers unofficially taught us what she learned from JFB-MFR and I treated my self for Thoracic Outlet Syndrome using the gentle sustained pressure while slowly stretching my neck. Works like a charm for me.

 

[Megan N]

Ulnar nerve palpation / treatment

The ulnar nerve is most prone to compression in the tunnel of Guyon at the wrist (this is a fibro-osseous tunnel between the hook of the hamate and the pisiform) and then in the cubital tunnel at the medial side of the elbow.

My treatment approach uses upper limb tension tests which selectively place tension along a particular nerve tract with the addition of sensitizing movements which place further tension and/or compression at certain sites along the nerve.

In this way, we can get a clearer idea of where the nerve is most compromised. Then, I use the irritability of the nerve to help decide the treatment intervention that is most likely to be useful. For irritable nerves, I fluctuate fluid pressures around and then within the nerve. For less irritable nerves, I decompress the nerve by releasing muscles, tendons and ligaments that are compressing it. For nerves that have adhesions within the nerve I use nerve stretching techniques.

Hope this helps.

If you have any nerve related questions, please don't hesitate to e-mail me through my website.

Thanks, Doug